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Automatic Braking Systems

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  • GilaGila Posts: 1,828 Senior Member
    tennmike said:
    Wambli, this fast reliable telecom service with high speed internet for everyone, including those of who live in the boonies and subsidize all the urban types. When will it reach the boonies? I'm tired of all y'all urbanites getting all the new upgraded service on MY DIME! :smiley:
    If I showed you my Verizon, Apple, ATMC, Hulu, Amazon Prime, Netflix... bills you’d faint... 🤣
    I doubt it.  You're the one who has to pay them; not any of us... 
    No good deed goes unpunished...
  • tennmiketennmike Senior Member Posts: 27,452 Senior Member
    Gila said:
    If I showed you my Verizon, Apple, ATMC, Hulu, Amazon Prime, Netflix... bills you’d faint... 🤣
    I doubt it.  You're the one who has to pay them; not any of us... 
    :D:D:D:D:D:D:D:D
      I refuse to answer that question on the grounds that I don't know the answer”
    ― Douglas Adams
  • zorbazorba Senior Member Posts: 23,949 Senior Member
    If I showed you my Verizon, Apple, ATMC, Hulu, Amazon Prime, Netflix... bills you’d faint... 🤣
    Yep, I'm sure I would. And I don't use any of them and laugh all the way to the bank.

    As far as cars go, I shouldn't have to buy a "1960s model" that is clapped out, beat up,  and worn out. I should be able to buy a 2019 equipped the way I want it to be - and AGAIN: Apparently, from what I hear, I could if I lived anywhere except North America. And once AGAIN: I should be "allowed" to drive that $15K Jeep from India on the public roads, its entirely adequate and has a SWEET diesel engine. But the NANNY STATE won't allow me. Elsewhere in the world, no problems, but Goddess forbid in the good ol' USA. This is Liberal crap at its worst.
    -Zorba, "The Veiled Male"

    "If you get it and didn't work for it, someone else worked for it and didn't get it..."
  • zorbazorba Senior Member Posts: 23,949 Senior Member
    Cars today are more reliable than ever before.  My 1978 GM was a steaming pile of junk parts by the time it reached 70k miles when the engine just self destructed.  Nowadays I can't recall the last time I had a catastrophic failure of any kind in my automobiles and I ran an H2 (a supposedly "unreliable GM product") for over 125k miles with no serious mechanical failures of any kind and absolutely no failure of the smart components or electrical convenience systems like power windows, power steering, cruise control, etc.  That is a far cry from my experience with cars in decades back.

    125K miles? Big deal. Talk to me when it gets to 500K - AND - all the wonderful "technology" is failing. That's the main problem I'm having with my old MBZ - it has entirely too much crap on it that I'm now having to deal with from time-to-time. But at least it doesn't have a computer that costs $50 to make, and $2,500 to replace WHEN it goes bad.
    Yea, I'd love to be able to buy a brand new 1963 GMC pickup with their legendary big block V6, and NO CRAP. Oh, but wait, I *can* buy a similar vehicle only better - but wait again, the Liberal-Socialist Nanny State (tm) won't let me drive it.
    I want 4 wheels - no, 5 with a REAL spare tire; an engine, manual transmission with decent gearing, RWD, cruise control, A/C, and transistorized ignition if its a gas motor. I probably wouldn't complain about mechanical fuel injection on gas either. Unless its a BIIIG vehicle, I don't even want power brakes (breaks :D ) or power steering - don't need them. I would prefer disk brakes though.
    Its a matter of what I *need*, not what the car companies, Telcos, and Nanny State want me to have, pay for, and maintain.
    -Zorba, "The Veiled Male"

    "If you get it and didn't work for it, someone else worked for it and didn't get it..."
  • breamfisherbreamfisher Senior Member Posts: 13,521 Senior Member
    Ya know who else thought the needs of the many superseded the needs of the one?
    Overkill is underrated.
  • rberglofrberglof Senior Member Posts: 2,689 Senior Member
    tennmike said:
    Wambli, this fast reliable telecom service with high speed internet for everyone, including those of who live in the boonies and subsidize all the urban types. When will it reach the boonies? I'm tired of all y'all urbanites getting all the new upgraded service on MY DIME! :smiley:

    Looks like a little slip from ABS but why not.
    My internet comes out of Minot almost 60 miles away and where I live houses are two to three miles apart but still SRT brought us fiber optics right into the house. My internet is 38 dollars a month and fast enough for video so happy with that, I am the last house on the run 3 miles from the house before me. I was on dial up before that, lived too far out on the run for anything else on copper line.
  • zorbazorba Senior Member Posts: 23,949 Senior Member
    If the go-kart can keep up with traffic, why not?
    The companies "cater" to us? Uh, no. They pile as much crap on as they can get away with! But you're right to a degree - Americans are IDIOTS when it comes to cars, they always have been. Instant gratification is part of the problem, I'd gladly wait several months for a vehicle I want, not what "they" want me to have. Heck, its a fight to get a car with a real transmission, even in the increasingly rare cases when one is actually available! I've walked out of more dealerships than I can count over that one piece of idiocy alone. They guy in the next town over is usually glad to get you what you want within the limitations of the product line - the last one was a Toyota Matrix that had to be driven in from 150 miles away.
    -Zorba, "The Veiled Male"

    "If you get it and didn't work for it, someone else worked for it and didn't get it..."
  • ilove22silove22s Senior Member Posts: 1,426 Senior Member
    edited November 2018 #39
    hey,

    Im giving you my experience with my subi and eyesight.  its a 2017 so not sure what "updates" if any and how it may differ from the 2018+

    but when i got my subi i asked about that.  How high or low it will detect something in front and the answer was about 3 feet tall and above.  So lets say a stroller or a small kid happen to run in front of the car, then i would say that the stroller and kid may need to be scrapped off the pavement.  Birds and squirrels have crossed my path and nothing happened.  As a matter of fact, a coyote crossed my path a few days ago and my dash cam caught it too, but my car didnt detect the animal..

    again, speaking from i know about my car and features, i can deactivate the Eyesight and collision warning/breaking and i have tested to see if it would not stop and it behaved just like a car without the eyesight and auto breaking.   And again, wont know what subi will do in the future.

    since the eyesight is "vision" based, it has its limitations.  If its cold out and there is fog on the window, the eyesight peepers will fog over also and will deactivate the system and will let you know the system is not working.  Once the windows and eyesight peepers are clear, the system will operate as normal.  Again, since its vision based, if i choose to not use the wipers when it rains, the eyesight system will eventually quit working and again let you know until the windshield is clear.

    It hasnt been that foggy here to determine if the eyesight will be able to see into or through the fog.  So that will be another test.  we do get fog here, but its not something that can be predicted or when i will out and about.

    what i also notice is that a car is moving in front, its easier for the eyesight to detect and track it.  However, if im coming up on stopped traffic with the eyesight in use such as at a stop light, it may not  "see" the stopped cars in front as easy and may do some hard breaking at the last moment.

    in the end i think you as a "informed" consumer need to know and understand the limitation of the cars and features.  In my opinion, this is just the beginning and its the way things will be in any new car.




    The ears never lie.

    - Don Burt
  • breamfisherbreamfisher Senior Member Posts: 13,521 Senior Member
    Ya know who else thought the needs of the many superseded the needs of the one?
    You are a nerd...  :D
    Why, because I know about Joseph Stalin, Pol Pot, Vladimir Lenin, Ho Chi Minh, and others?  What you call being a nerd, I call being a student of history.

    Those who fail to learn from history are doomed to repeat it.  Those who did study history are doomed to watch those who failed to learn from history repeat those mistakes.
    Overkill is underrated.
  • ilove22silove22s Senior Member Posts: 1,426 Senior Member
    regarding Darwin,

    I have no issue with Darwin.  Its when some innocent person or collateral damage is what bothers me.

    If those people that want to off themselves not matter how they do it, just do it by themselves, im all for it.  But in some cases, they usually involve someone else.

    On a stretch of road along the river and near our airport some motorcyclist bit the dust big time.  Its no passing and visibility is clear too, but for some reason that motorcyclist decided the laws didnt apply to them and they passed and ended up a smear on the road.  Not the first time it has happen and wont be the last.  I use to drive the stretch alot but now not much so.  

    Some people love to drive and sit behind a wheel, i for one dont care to spend my time that way.  I love using the trains/subways in Europe and wish we had one to use, but for now, i have to drive.

    There are those that will benefit from the advance technology such as the elderly and it will give them back their freedom again.  Just today i saw and older couple in a car take a turn around a corner and the driver ran up on the corner.  Going about 10 mph slower than traffic too.  






    The ears never lie.

    - Don Burt
  • das68das68 Posts: 662 Senior Member
    Ya know who else thought the needs of the many superseded the needs of the one?
    You are a nerd...  :D
    Why, because I know about Joseph Stalin, Pol Pot, Vladimir Lenin, Ho Chi Minh, and others?  What you call being a nerd, I call being a student of history.





  • zorbazorba Senior Member Posts: 23,949 Senior Member
    ilove22s said:

    Some people love to drive and sit behind a wheel, i for one dont care to spend my time that way.  I love using the trains/subways in Europe and wish we had one to use, but for now, i have to drive.

    I *can* enjoy it. I enjoy interacting with the machine and the road - hence my disdain for technology. I have yet to drive a car with power steering that has the road feel that manual steering has for instance.
    OTOH, the cell fone addicts I have to share the road with? Uh, not so much!
    -Zorba, "The Veiled Male"

    "If you get it and didn't work for it, someone else worked for it and didn't get it..."
  • breamfisherbreamfisher Senior Member Posts: 13,521 Senior Member
    Well, they are your role models in keeping your power based on tenuous circumstances, capricious rules, and fear of being erased  (ban hammer.)

    Them and Emperor Palpatine. You're not force-sensitive or -able.
    Overkill is underrated.
  • 10canyon5310canyon53 Member Posts: 2,122 Senior Member
    orchidman said:
    Jayhawker said:
    I have a question about cars with Automatic Braking Systems....Say you're driving along and a possum runs out in front of you...Does the car slam on the brakes or does it just run right over the little bastard?
    If it did, I would be sending it back to have that option disarmed..........

    Which brings up another interesting question. If you are offroading and hit the loud pedal to crash through some brush, will the vehicle respond or will it brake?
    Ok, to get this thread back on track and answer a question you guys left hanging out there....The brush should be unharmed.  The rental vehicle I was driving this week was a brand new Dodge Ram 4x4 (with Hemi of course).  I was backing into a parking space while listening to the back up sensors scream about the bush I was about to run over.  I could see that it was just a small bush in my backup camera so I wasn't worried about it.  Just before the rear bumper whacked the bush the brake pedal pushed itself and the truck stopped suddenly a couple of inches short of the bush.

  • FFLshooterFFLshooter Member Posts: 1,057 Senior Member
    Antilock brakes are stupid. When I cram my foot down in the brake, I want my wheels to stop turning. Years ago I was driving a 2010 Dodge Charger (make long story short), went to brake in a few inches of snow and kept heading for a building that was quickly coming up on me and the damn ABS wouldn’t stop pulsing. Finally crammed the shifter into park about 3’ from the wall. Had the brakes locked, none of that would have happened.
  • 10canyon5310canyon53 Member Posts: 2,122 Senior Member
    The point of anti-lock brakes is so that you can maintain enough control to steer around the obstacle.  As soon as your wheels lock up you lose all directional control.  This often results in sliding into whatever you were trying to avoid.
  • tennmiketennmike Senior Member Posts: 27,452 Senior Member
    Ya know who else thought the needs of the many superseded the needs of the one?
    Ya DO know that that sentence, "“Logic clearly dictates that the needs of the many outweigh the needs of the few" is part of the communist collective thought process, and also the pure democracy (majority rule). The individual or the minority will be ground into the dust.

    Anyway, ABS is a crutch run by an electronic brain. Electronics fail on a regular basis, and computers get screwed up all on their own. If you are complacent and rely on that automatic braking system to stop your vehicle because of an object in front of you stopped or slowing, you might end up like the driver of that Tesla in Florida that slammed into an 18-wheeler across the road. The sensors didn't 'see it' so the car hit it at a high rate of speed. At least the driver didn't have to worry about the next payment on it, or anything else, for that matter.

    I'll take Commander Scott's (Scotty) advice on complicated electronics and whiz bang new tech.

    Scotty:"Aye, sir. The more they overthink the plumbing, the easier it is to stop up the drain."
      I refuse to answer that question on the grounds that I don't know the answer”
    ― Douglas Adams
  • JermanatorJermanator Senior Member Posts: 16,131 Senior Member
    Years ago I was driving a 2010 Dodge Charger (make long story short), went to brake in a few inches of snow and kept heading for a building that was quickly coming up on me and the damn ABS wouldn’t stop pulsing. Finally crammed the shifter into park about 3’ from the wall. Had the brakes locked, none of that would have happened.
    They do suck in snow. I have found shifting in neutral helps quite a bit in those situations.
    Reason obeys itself; and ignorance submits to whatever is dictated to it.
    -Thomas Paine
  • earlyagainearlyagain Posts: 6,872 Senior Member
    Oh wow!
    I thought the needs of the many out weigh the needs of the one originated with Spock on Star Trek. 😯
  • zorbazorba Senior Member Posts: 23,949 Senior Member
    I've made my entire living in high tech - computers and electronics. I consider same to be one of the most UN-reliable things ever created by man. Silicon junctions WILL fail, its only a matter of time. Anything beyond 20 years is extremely good, but anything beyond about 10 is "borrowed time".
    But I hear you about self-driving cars - there's a part of me that wants them too. Not for myself - until I get so decrepit that I can't drive - but as you say, for all the other morons on the road who are doing anything and everything except DRIVE. Mainly buried in their smart fones...
    -Zorba, "The Veiled Male"

    "If you get it and didn't work for it, someone else worked for it and didn't get it..."
  • orchidmanorchidman Senior Member Posts: 8,145 Senior Member
    orchidman said:
    Jayhawker said:
    I have a question about cars with Automatic Braking Systems....Say you're driving along and a possum runs out in front of you...Does the car slam on the brakes or does it just run right over the little bastard?
    If it did, I would be sending it back to have that option disarmed..........

    Which brings up another interesting question. If you are offroading and hit the loud pedal to crash through some brush, will the vehicle respond or will it brake?
    Ok, to get this thread back on track and answer a question you guys left hanging out there....The brush should be unharmed.  The rental vehicle I was driving this week was a brand new Dodge Ram 4x4 (with Hemi of course).  I was backing into a parking space while listening to the back up sensors scream about the bush I was about to run over.  I could see that it was just a small bush in my backup camera so I wasn't worried about it.  Just before the rear bumper whacked the bush the brake pedal pushed itself and the truck stopped suddenly a couple of inches short of the bush.

    Thanks for answering that question.

    Guess my next work/hunting vehicle will have to be a Series 2A Landrover from the 70's. Basic engine, no electronics, manual transmission with the optional 'Do you want brakes' package and ' Lucas, Lord of the Dark' headlights system.......................( No stereo cos you cant even have a conversation with your passengers let alone listen to music cos of the lack of sound insulation and a gearbox/differential system that sounds like its full of rocks and sand)

    The more I think about it the more I want one actually. I remember the good old days of having to stop, get out and manually turn the hubs over to put it in 4WD, not this new fangled idea of pressing a button on the dash..............
    Still enjoying the trip of a lifetime and making the best of what I have.....
  • das68das68 Posts: 662 Senior Member
    edited November 2018 #53
    orchidman said:


    Guess my next work/hunting vehicle will have to be a Series 2A Landrover from the 70's. Basic engine, no electronics, manual transmission with the optional 'Do you want brakes' package and ' Lucas, Lord of the Dark' headlights system.......................( No stereo cos you cant even have a conversation with your passengers let alone listen to music cos of the lack of sound insulation and a gearbox/differential system that sounds like its full of rocks and sand)

    The more I think about it the more I want one actually. I remember the good old days of having to stop, get out and manually turn the hubs over to put it in 4WD, not this new fangled idea of pressing a button on the dash..............

     

    You might pick this up cheap;


    got a flashy blue light on top.


    or something more classic?


    a 1/2 Ton Lightweight.




    comes with all mod cons upfront.






  • zorbazorba Senior Member Posts: 23,949 Senior Member
    Niiiiiice!
    -Zorba, "The Veiled Male"

    "If you get it and didn't work for it, someone else worked for it and didn't get it..."
  • GilaGila Posts: 1,828 Senior Member
    zorba said:
    If the go-kart can keep up with traffic, why not?
    The companies "cater" to us? Uh, no. They pile as much crap on as they can get away with! But you're right to a degree - Americans are IDIOTS when it comes to cars, they always have been. Instant gratification is part of the problem, I'd gladly wait several months for a vehicle I want, not what "they" want me to have. Heck, its a fight to get a car with a real transmission, even in the increasingly rare cases when one is actually available! I've walked out of more dealerships than I can count over that one piece of idiocy alone. They guy in the next town over is usually glad to get you what you want within the limitations of the product line - the last one was a Toyota Matrix that had to be driven in from 150 miles away.
    The trick is to get the best deal you can, then make it into what you want.  Here's my ride as an example; all 500 rear wheel hp of it...

    No good deed goes unpunished...
  • coolgunguycoolgunguy Senior Member Posts: 6,614 Senior Member
    I don't have a problem with things like auto braking being AVAILABLE.  I have a BIG problem with them becoming MANDATORY, as "good ideas" often will.  It won't happen, you say?

    Tell that to all the folks who are driving vehicles with passive restraints/seat belt reminders, TPMs, rear back up cameras, multiple air bags, stability control and a host of other items that aren't bad things to have and which probably all qualify as a "good idea"... but also work to make the vehicles we buy much more expensive.  Interestingly, ABS is not one of the required "good ideas".

    Strange, no?

    For other types of good ideas that are becoming mandatory - or at least heading that direction, or are ubiquitous enough that they might just add well be mandatory - look at roundabouts and various highway interchange configurations that are popping up everywhere. Then, take a look at all the warning signage that is plastered to virtually EVERYTHING these days. Then, have a gander at things like asthma inhalers that are mandated to be "environmentally friendly" by not having CFCs that easy holes in the ozone... used to be I could get an inhaler over the counter for less than $20 whenever I needed one.  Now, my "good idea" inhaler costs me $97 each time I pick it up, and God help me if I need one more often than every 30 days.

    I'm waiting for lane change warnings, 360° cameras and the auto braking we've been talking about to become part of the standard package. Remember, you heard it here, first... it will happen.

    Don't think so?  

    Bet me. 
    "Bipartisan" usually means that a bigger than normal deception is happening.
    George Carlin
  • zorbazorba Senior Member Posts: 23,949 Senior Member
    No bet. I could have written that post.
    Don't get me started on how the FDA caused Terpinhydrate, about the only cough suppressant that actually WORKS, to be removed from the market. At about $1/bottle. You *can* still get it as an Rx at a "Compounding Pharmacy" at about $100/bottle.
    I don't have problems with roundabouts, what I have problems with are stupid Americans who don't know how to use one correctly. Once you're in it, you NEVER stop!!!!
    -Zorba, "The Veiled Male"

    "If you get it and didn't work for it, someone else worked for it and didn't get it..."
  • 10canyon5310canyon53 Member Posts: 2,122 Senior Member
    orchidman said:

    Guess my next work/hunting vehicle will have to be a Series 2A Landrover from the 70's. Basic engine, no electronics, manual transmission with the optional 'Do you want brakes' package and ' Lucas, Lord of the Dark' headlights system.......................( No stereo cos you cant even have a conversation with your passengers let alone listen to music cos of the lack of sound insulation and a gearbox/differential system that sounds like its full of rocks and sand)

    The more I think about it the more I want one actually. I remember the good old days of having to stop, get out and manually turn the hubs over to put it in 4WD, not this new fangled idea of pressing a button on the dash..............
    In 1970 my father was looking for a truck to take to Panama to replace his International Scout.  The new Chevrolet Blazer attracted his attention and the price seemed pretty good.  Then the salesman sat him down to discuss options.......and started by asking "Do you want seats?"  Not too far into discussing "options" my dad got up and walked out.  He ended up buying a Nissan Patrol when he got back to Panama.
  • coolgunguycoolgunguy Senior Member Posts: 6,614 Senior Member
    I have no problem USING roundabouts.  I have a problem with municipalities dropping them EVERYWHERE simply because Uncle shook out the piggy bank.  I get trying to be safer.  Honest, I do. My point was about the mandatory nature of all these "good ideas" that turn out to be less than advertised in their implementation, but still remain mandatory because somebody figured they should be. 
    "Bipartisan" usually means that a bigger than normal deception is happening.
    George Carlin
  • zorbazorba Senior Member Posts: 23,949 Senior Member
    An IHC Scout. Another vehicle I wouldn't mind owning.
    -Zorba, "The Veiled Male"

    "If you get it and didn't work for it, someone else worked for it and didn't get it..."
  • 10canyon5310canyon53 Member Posts: 2,122 Senior Member
    My  father discovered that the Scout did not have enough ground clearance for running around in the jungles of Panama.  My mom has a picture somewhere of the Scout being pulled out of a mud hole by a horse.
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