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Davy Crockett on the Power to Make Charitable Donations

tennmiketennmike Senior MemberPosts: 27,395 Senior Member
I hate to have to put this post in the 2A/Politics section as it gets little traffic now. With all the stuff going on in Congress now about free stuff from the coffers of the Treasury, it bears reading again as it is on point. I learned this story in American History in grammar school. It might be a little long to read, but is well worth the time to do so. It puts the understanding of the Constitution of the United States by the people of the time of Crockett in sharp contrast to what we have now. And that old farmer was right, too.


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Replies

  • GilaGila Posts: 1,828 Senior Member
    I hope that everyone who views this thread, clicks on the link, and reads the entire story.  Even more than that, I hope they share it with others.
    No good deed goes unpunished...
  • earlyagainearlyagain Posts: 6,748 Senior Member
    Good read. I'll for sure give it some thought. There remains unsettled after it, the question of what is individual charity and what is common welfare?
  • GilaGila Posts: 1,828 Senior Member
    There is no provision for "common welfare" in the US Constitution.  The 10th Amendment covers this.
    No good deed goes unpunished...
  • earlyagainearlyagain Posts: 6,748 Senior Member
    The preamble establishes intent to promote the general welfare.

    Constitutional or not, there exists an established presidence of congressional allocation of funds to entities, groups, communties, and institutions that lend themselves to debatable scrutiny. In the present absence of Horatio Bunce, definitive conclusion becomes illusive.

    This does not discount or diminish the arrogance of congress addressed in the story, but it does leave extensive debate unresolved.
  • TeachTeach Senior Member Posts: 18,428 Senior Member
    I have a longtime friend from my college days back in the 1960's who spent the majority of his working career as a federal bureaucrat in Washington DC (Department of Transportation).  His wife built a very successful (and hugely profitable) business, teaching seminars to people on how to write applications for government grants, ones funding various programs to maximize the number of dollars they could suck from the public teat.  Apparently, there's an entire cottage industry involved in the business of being lifelong parasites of public funds.  We never get the opportunity to vote those people out of a job- - - -they just keep on doing their thing, no matter which political party happens to claw its way to the top of the DC dung heap!     
  • earlyagainearlyagain Posts: 6,748 Senior Member
    It makes it pretty easy for the arbitrary claim of entitlement.
  • GilaGila Posts: 1,828 Senior Member
    I've done quite a bit of research and can't find any documentation that Crockett ever uttered these words. Not implying it's not true but I tend to hold these online "quotes" in the same light as Admiral Isoroku Yamamoto supposedly saying: "You cannot invade mainland United States. There would be a rifle behind each blade of grass." 
    I heard this story about 50 years ago...
    No good deed goes unpunished...
  • tennmiketennmike Senior Member Posts: 27,395 Senior Member
    I've done quite a bit of research and can't find any documentation that Crockett ever uttered these words. Not implying it's not true but I tend to hold these online "quotes" in the same light as Admiral Isoroku Yamamoto supposedly saying: "You cannot invade mainland United States. There would be a rifle behind each blade of grass." 
    Well, I can say that what your search turned up would be what I would suspect. Speeches in Congress were not transcribed as a general rule in Congress at that time. If you were expecting to find a copy of the speech in Congress in the Congressional Record then you would be sorely disappointed. I would surmise that Davy Crockett's speech in Congress was extemporaneous in nature with no prepared written speech prepared in advance. That would be common for the time, too.
    So, too would be the conversation with the farmer, Horatio Bunce not be recorded.
    From the webiste:
    The following excerpt from an 1884 biography by Edward Sylvester Ellis, The Life of Colonel David Crockett, if accurate, might reveal how his own rural electorate taught him the importance of adhering to the Constitution and the perils of ignoring its restrictions.

    At any rate, truth or fable, the underlying lesson from both parts of the story is still valid. If you feel more comfortable about it, put it in the same class of Aesop's Fables. The lessons taught in the fables are no less true just because they are fables. :)


      I refuse to answer that question on the grounds that I don't know the answer”
    ― Douglas Adams
  • 1965Jeff1965Jeff Senior Member Posts: 1,644 Senior Member
    Really hits home with common sense from common men. Thanks for sharing this.
  • TeachTeach Senior Member Posts: 18,428 Senior Member

    David Crockett had the political misfortune to lock horns with another prominent Tennesseean, Andrew Jackson, over the forced relocation of the Cherokee Nation to Oklahoma than came to be known as the "Trail of Tears".   Then, as now, getting crossways with the head of one's party is pretty much a way of committing political suicide.  Jackson was an authoritarian bully, while it seems Crockett was more in touch with his fellow citizens and tried to represent all of them, not just the rich and powerful.  Crockett's move to Texas was at least in part an effort to reboot his political career.  He didn't really intend to get trapped in the Alamo, but once there, he apparently made a heroic effort to defend the place and buy some breathing room For his fellow Texans to prepare for the final battle.  Sam Houston was another Tennesseean who figured prominently in the Texans' fight for freedom, after abandoning his new bride and his post as Governor of Tennessee abruptly, under some pretty unusual and mostly secretive circumstances. 

    I attended high school while living on land that once belonged to Andrew Jackson, and just a few miles west of our farm in Lawrenceburg was where Crockett owned a gunpowder mill before moving to Texas.

     

  • earlyagainearlyagain Posts: 6,748 Senior Member
    I read an very detailed volume about the relocation of the Cherokee Nation inclusive of extensive background. That along with the Daniel Boone biography revealed a very complexed and convoluted system of real estate transaction.

    Both books were striking not only in the process and adjudication of land acquisition, but also in the brutal violence of those times. Some of the published incidents were fit for modern day horror movies.
  • Old RonOld Ron Senior Member Posts: 4,265 Senior Member
    It was a good read .... thanks Mike !
    People like to think of those times as simple but they were just as complex as today .
    All the crooks will never be gone but we can only hope to lessen there numbers in our time . Holding people to the truth one at a time is a good start . Looking the other way is how it grows to this big . Anyone that tells you what you want without asking you is a person that needs to go . Right & wrong had a baby & it is the grey area . Grey is where problems are but nothing done about .  ( crap ... I try to stay out of politics but didn't this time lol )
  • tennmiketennmike Senior Member Posts: 27,395 Senior Member
    Speaking of Jackson and the Cherokee removal, let's not forget that the gold strike in Dahlonega, GA that hastened the process of the Cherokee removal. Dahlonega was home to the Cherokee and Creek Indians. Couldn't have them there with a gold strike going on. Ugly part of history.




      I refuse to answer that question on the grounds that I don't know the answer”
    ― Douglas Adams
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