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Remington 700 CDL 280 Remington -- been a while.

JasonMPDJasonMPD Senior MemberPosts: 6,535 Senior Member
Work, business, etc. seriously prolonged some gun projects. My 280 being one in particular.  When I bought it about 2012-13 I did so with the plan to reload exclusively for it.  That's still the case and finally after not having a set up bench, I've started loading again as y'all have seen in my recent posts. 

Talk of the Berger 7mm 168gr Classic Hunter in another thread motivated me to dig them out of a box and load up some test loads. 

Well, test chambering said loads brought me back to a matter with this gun I'd meant to have addressed a couple years ago:

In my opinion the chamber is too tight. Even off the shelf ammo needs a bit of downward pressure to close the bolt. Second to that it has the shortest  leade I have ever encountered on a rifle. This picture provides an example:



The brass case won't close.  The nickel case will. Bullet in the brass case is about 0.125" farther out.  Am I losing my mind here or does that seem...off.

So maybe it's time I get a headspace go-gauge for the 280 or have it inspected. If I have to send it to Remington I won't see it until 2020.  The rounds I have fired didn't appear to show chamber pressure issues, but not all evidence is plainly visible. 

Thoughts?
“There are three kinds of men. The one that learns by reading. The few who learn by observation. The rest of them have to pee on the electric fence for themselves.” – Will Rogers

Replies

  • ZeeZee Senior Member Posts: 23,521 Senior Member
    Throated for 140 gr bullets maybe?

    Yes, it appears short throated. 
    "To Hell with efficiency, it's performance we want!" - Elmer Keith
  • JasonMPDJasonMPD Senior Member Posts: 6,535 Senior Member
    Zee said:
    Throated for 140 gr bullets maybe?

    Yes, it appears short throated. 
    Could be. If "traditionally" chambered I'm sure it is.  But for a gun made in 2010/11 that seems a bit shortsighted. 
    “There are three kinds of men. The one that learns by reading. The few who learn by observation. The rest of them have to pee on the electric fence for themselves.” – Will Rogers
  • ZeeZee Senior Member Posts: 23,521 Senior Member
    JasonMPD said:
    Zee said:
    Throated for 140 gr bullets maybe?

    Yes, it appears short throated. 
    Could be. If "traditionally" chambered I'm sure it is.  But for a gun made in 2010/11 that seems a bit shortsighted. 
    Welcome to the world of the gun manufacturers. 

    Short sightedness is their forte. 
    "To Hell with efficiency, it's performance we want!" - Elmer Keith
  • ZeeZee Senior Member Posts: 23,521 Senior Member
    Only in the past two years have I finally seem forward thinking in the twist rate/barrel length/threading concept. 
    "To Hell with efficiency, it's performance we want!" - Elmer Keith
  • JasonMPDJasonMPD Senior Member Posts: 6,535 Senior Member
    I may ask for some quotes from good gunsmiths and inquire about making the chambering easier/smoother and reaming the leade forward a bit.  It could go a long way to make this rifle truly nice.
    “There are three kinds of men. The one that learns by reading. The few who learn by observation. The rest of them have to pee on the electric fence for themselves.” – Will Rogers
  • earlyagainearlyagain Posts: 6,728 Senior Member
    You may be able to use a case guage and differing resizing die adjustments to determine if the chamber is too tight for your desire, or something you can live with by sizing cases to fit.
  • FreezerFreezer Senior Member Posts: 1,737 Senior Member
    IIRC the 257 Roberts and 280 Remington are the two cartridges that benefit most from AI. If it needs reamed it might be worth considering.
    I like Elmer Keith; I married his daughter :wink:
  • BigslugBigslug Senior Member Posts: 8,148 Senior Member
    This seems to be a common thing with the chamber blueprints used by Remington - possibly others.

    When I discovered that weather that is good for deer hunting is not weather that is good for blued steel and walnut, I picked up a 700 XCR II in .30-06.  My father liked what he saw and bought the identical rifle in .280.

    My .30-06 has a serendipitously long throat.  Since I wanted the rifle to do double duty for deer and elk with one load, and the California lead ban was on the horizon, I ended up with the 168 grain Barnes TTSX, I'm about to seat that long bullet long.  I'm using almost all of the magazine, able to fit in a nice hatful of H4350, and have that pill going out a 2,975 fps.

    Dad's rifle was the complete opposite.  Light varmint bullets were tight to the lands in that thing.  As I recall, he had our gunsmith run a throating reamer in it to lengthen it to something useful.  Only downside to the rifle now is that in their infinite wisdom, Remington built it with a 1-10 twist instead of 1-9, so its ability to throw the heavies is a bit compromised.
    WWJMBD?

    "Nothing is safe from stupid." - Zee
  • JasonMPDJasonMPD Senior Member Posts: 6,535 Senior Member
    Bigslug said:
    This seems to be a common thing with the chamber blueprints used by Remington - possibly others.

    When I discovered that weather that is good for deer hunting is not weather that is good for blued steel and walnut, I picked up a 700 XCR II in .30-06.  My father liked what he saw and bought the identical rifle in .280.

    My .30-06 has a serendipitously long throat.  Since I wanted the rifle to do double duty for deer and elk with one load, and the California lead ban was on the horizon, I ended up with the 168 grain Barnes TTSX, I'm about to seat that long bullet long.  I'm using almost all of the magazine, able to fit in a nice hatful of H4350, and have that pill going out a 2,975 fps.

    Dad's rifle was the complete opposite.  Light varmint bullets were tight to the lands in that thing.  As I recall, he had our gunsmith run a throating reamer in it to lengthen it to something useful.  Only downside to the rifle now is that in their infinite wisdom, Remington built it with a 1-10 twist instead of 1-9, so its ability to throw the heavies is a bit compromised.

    Yeam mine is 1:10.  I can live with it since some 168's will still stabilize if they aren't the "ELD" and "VLD" variety.  I don't necessarily care about high BC bullets, just some heavier options for larger game.

    I'm going to look into the throat reaming and maybe having it reamed to AI.  An AI conversion could be a little useful being as it's a 24" barrel.

    I'll double check my sizing die too, but even factory ammo is a bit snug in the chamber. 
    “There are three kinds of men. The one that learns by reading. The few who learn by observation. The rest of them have to pee on the electric fence for themselves.” – Will Rogers
  • snake284snake284 Senior Member Posts: 22,387 Senior Member
    edited August 2019 #11
    My .280 is a Shaw Barrel and has a nice long throat. The one I have a problem with is my .257 AI. That thing's tight. I Iike to load 115 grain Combined Technologies Ballistic Tips in it but I have to seat them short or I can't close the bolt. It being on a Yugo medium length action the magazine is long enough to seat them out another 20-30 thousandths or so and drop another 3 or 5 grains powder giving it another 150-200 FPS. I asked my gun smith if he could ream out the lead a bit but he said he'd never had to do that before. Well there's always a first time. I'm going to have him do it.
    Daddy, what's an enabler?
    Son that's somebody with nothing to do with his time but keep me in trouble with mom.
  • JasonMPDJasonMPD Senior Member Posts: 6,535 Senior Member
    Found a chart and it appears the 280 Rem standard chamber has a 0.179" (+/- .002") free bore, and the angle into the lands is 45 degrees.  That's both a short lead and a steep contact into the lands.

    I may Cerosafe the chamber and see what it's dimensions are.  But it's probably got to go to a gunsmith to verify chamber dimensions and diagnose lengthening the freebore.
    “There are three kinds of men. The one that learns by reading. The few who learn by observation. The rest of them have to pee on the electric fence for themselves.” – Will Rogers
  • BigslugBigslug Senior Member Posts: 8,148 Senior Member
    If you don't have one of these, it's worth it's proverbial weight:  https://www.sinclairintl.com/reloading-equipment/measuring-tools/bullet-seating-depth-tools/length-gauge-prod70272.aspx

    Failing that, seating a bullet  with the ogive a tad further out than expected in a fired, unsized case, maybe with a little dry erase marker on it to take an imprint from the leade would probably tell you much.
    WWJMBD?

    "Nothing is safe from stupid." - Zee
  • JasonMPDJasonMPD Senior Member Posts: 6,535 Senior Member
    Bigslug said:
    If you don't have one of these, it's worth it's proverbial weight:  https://www.sinclairintl.com/reloading-equipment/measuring-tools/bullet-seating-depth-tools/length-gauge-prod70272.aspx

    Failing that, seating a bullet  with the ogive a tad further out than expected in a fired, unsized case, maybe with a little dry erase marker on it to take an imprint from the leade would probably tell you much.
    I have one. But the chamber is too tight.  I can't seat the modified case by hand.
    “There are three kinds of men. The one that learns by reading. The few who learn by observation. The rest of them have to pee on the electric fence for themselves.” – Will Rogers
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