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Time for an honest discussioin on Glock pistols

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  • GunNutGunNut Posts: 7,642 Senior Member
    Diver43 said:
    An old crusty ARMY Master Sergeant once taught a couple young knuckleheads about hand guns.

    He held up a gun that none of us had ever seen or heard of before.  He asked  "where is the safety on this weapon?"  Everyone was pointing to the lever on the side of the pistol.  He shouted  WRONG, every swinging %$!* sitting here.  The main safety of every weapon/gun is BETWEEN YOUR EARS.  Use your brain and do not touch the trigger.

    Seeing that happened in 1979, I would say that the lesson stuck for me.
    That's why I was pointing out on another thread that a thumb safety accidentally sweeping off on a 1911 is really not a big deal.  Probably more psychological than anything else.  The chances of the holstered 1911 just going off in your holster are non-existent.  You still need to disengage the grip safety AND press the trigger for the gun to go off.  Unless you have no clue what you are doing, or have poor training or bad habits these two things do not coincide until you are on target and have decided to shoot.  Otherwise having a gun with an external safety won't save you from an eventual AD or ND.
  • knitepoetknitepoet Senior Member Posts: 22,602 Senior Member
    edited June 10 #273
    Before everyone had decent cellphone cameras, Small automatic digital cameras were all the rage, compared to the bigger, harder to operate DSLRs. They were "point and click" 

    I see Glocks in the same way. In an emergency all you have to do is aim, point and click (bang)

    No difficult manual of arms.
    I've heard of people forgetting to  click a safety off under stress, however, I've never heard of someone forgetting to pull the trigger. THAT, IMO, is the beauty of the Glock system. The easiest thing to remember to do, pulling the trigger, releases all of the Glock's safeties and results in the "bang" you needed.

    And to throw in an OLD joke...
    What's worse than hearing a "bang" when you expect a "click"?
    Hearing a "click" when you NEED a "bang" :o
    Seven Habits of Highly Effective Pirates, Rule #37: There is no “overkill”. There is only “open fire” and “I need to reload”.


  • zorbazorba Senior Member Posts: 24,745 Senior Member
    edited June 10 #274
    I have a preference for my carry gun to have a manual safety. That's just me. I own numerous pistols without one, or they have a decocker. As everyone here knows, most modern Rugers have a "Pro" version without a manual safety. I guess that makes the version with the safety the "Tyro" version - and I'm OK with that. ;)
    As for Glocks in general, I've shot several of their models. Good shooters all, but they didn't do anything for me - until I shot a 43. Hitherto, all Glocks I had shot had been gen 3s, the 43's gen 4 ergonomics put it neck on neck with the Ruger LC9s as a carry piece, lack of safety be damned. I ended up with the Ruger mainly because Big Chief - Goddess bless that evil enabler! - found the LC9s at an unbelievable price on one of PSA's blowouts. And it is nice - for my brain - to have that manual safety - I'm always concerned I may do something stupid drawing it out of the holster. But I would have been happy with the G43, and I certainly like a certain Glock 17 clone that I may or may not have in my possession....
    -Zorba, "The Veiled Male"

    "If you get it and didn't work for it, someone else worked for it and didn't get it..."
    )O(
  • breamfisherbreamfisher Senior Member Posts: 13,722 Senior Member
    Regarding manual safeties being inherently safer...



    Overkill is underrated.
  • ZeeZee Senior Member Posts: 26,471 Senior Member
    Regarding manual safeties being inherently safer...



    Hey, get with the program!  Stick to the agenda!
    "To Hell with efficiency, it's performance we want!" - Elmer Keith
  • breamfisherbreamfisher Senior Member Posts: 13,722 Senior Member
    I'm a firm believer in the idea that if you build it idiot-proof, they'll just build a better idiot.
    Overkill is underrated.
  • breamfisherbreamfisher Senior Member Posts: 13,722 Senior Member
    Or to put it another way, park rangers and bear biologists have noticed there is an almost complete overlap between the smartest of bears and the dumbest of campers/tourists.  This makes the construction of bear-proof trash cans very difficult to impossible.
    Overkill is underrated.
  • GunNutGunNut Posts: 7,642 Senior Member
    Has nothing to do with the safety!  Tex made it VERY clear that this was due to the Serpa holster he was using that day being no good...  So THERE!    >:)

    All jokes aside that idiot Tex almost killed the Serpa singlehandedly.  After his "accident" a bunch of folks started banning the Serpa in the classes and ranges!!!  I STILL hear from supposedly educated people saying the design is flawed...
  • GunNutGunNut Posts: 7,642 Senior Member
    I guess the new guy was not really interested in a discussion?  Only wanted to share his wisdom with us… 
  • JayhawkerJayhawker Moderator Posts: 17,732 Senior Member
    GunNut said:
    I guess the new guy was not really interested in a discussion?  Only wanted to share his wisdom with us… 
    His "wisdom" has been noted...ignored...but noted...
    Sharps Model 1874 - "The rifle that made the west safe for Winchester"
  • JayhawkerJayhawker Moderator Posts: 17,732 Senior Member
    GunNut said:
    Has nothing to do with the safety!  Tex made it VERY clear that this was due to the Serpa holster he was using that day being no good...  So THERE!    >:)

    All jokes aside that idiot Tex almost killed the Serpa singlehandedly.  After his "accident" a bunch of folks started banning the Serpa in the classes and ranges!!!  I STILL hear from supposedly educated people saying the design is flawed...
    I have used Sherpas in comps and on duty for years...and just can't help but wonder how in the hell that design contributes to someone shooting themselves...just keep your damned finger off the damned trigger until you're ready to shoot
    Sharps Model 1874 - "The rifle that made the west safe for Winchester"
  • ZeeZee Senior Member Posts: 26,471 Senior Member
    Jayhawker said:
    GunNut said:
    Has nothing to do with the safety!  Tex made it VERY clear that this was due to the Serpa holster he was using that day being no good...  So THERE!    >:)

    All jokes aside that idiot Tex almost killed the Serpa singlehandedly.  After his "accident" a bunch of folks started banning the Serpa in the classes and ranges!!!  I STILL hear from supposedly educated people saying the design is flawed...
    I have used Sherpas in comps and on duty for years...and just can't help but wonder how in the hell that design contributes to someone shooting themselves...just keep your damned finger off the damned trigger until you're ready to shoot
    I still run them almost daily. 
    "To Hell with efficiency, it's performance we want!" - Elmer Keith
  • breamfisherbreamfisher Senior Member Posts: 13,722 Senior Member

    Overkill is underrated.
  • GunNutGunNut Posts: 7,642 Senior Member
    Jayhawker said:
    GunNut said:
    Has nothing to do with the safety!  Tex made it VERY clear that this was due to the Serpa holster he was using that day being no good...  So THERE!    >:)

    All jokes aside that idiot Tex almost killed the Serpa singlehandedly.  After his "accident" a bunch of folks started banning the Serpa in the classes and ranges!!!  I STILL hear from supposedly educated people saying the design is flawed...
    I have used Sherpas in comps and on duty for years...and just can't help but wonder how in the hell that design contributes to someone shooting themselves...just keep your damned finger off the damned trigger until you're ready to shoot
    Tex Grebner, the YouTube sensation, got into the habit of sweeping the thumb safety off when he acquired his grip on a 1911 while the gun is still in the holster.  Not necessarily a "bad" habit, I know a lot of folks that draw a 1911 that way rather successfully, but by sweeping the thumb safety off before drawing you peel off the first TWO layer of the 3 safety layers in the 1911 since now both the thumb AND the grip safety are disengaged, so now you have to exercise a wee bit more caution to make sure that trigger is not addressed before a good sight picture acquisition.

    Then he did the REALLY dumb thing...  He obviously never trained in the proper use of a Serpa so instead of laying his trigger finger fully extended along the outside of the holster he got used to pushing the release with the tip of his finger.  BAD JU-JU!!!!!

    He then proceeded to screw up his draw and tugged HARD at the Serpa (and his belt/pants which were about 3 inches under his butt crack) which usually locks up the works, and this obviously made him push harder with the tip of his trigger finger until enough force was exerted that he finally defeated the holster retention device.  

    Unfortunately, since his trigger finger was already hooked and pushing hard against the holster AND the thumb and grip safeties had already been disengaged with his grip, as the gun was liberated from the holster his booger pick swiftly slid RIGHT INTO the trigger guard with enough force to press the trigger to discharge right into his thigh.

    But it's all good, as he explained in his follow up video, his training took over and he called him mom...


  • JayhawkerJayhawker Moderator Posts: 17,732 Senior Member
    Well...at least the pistol functioned as intended...all the safeties disengaged and when he pulled the trigger it went off...can't blame the gun!
    Sharps Model 1874 - "The rifle that made the west safe for Winchester"
  • JustsomedudeJustsomedude Posts: 1,152 Senior Member

    What about a Sherpa wearing a Serpa?
    *mind blown*
    We've been conditioned to believe that obedience is virtuous and voting is freedom- 
  • breamfisherbreamfisher Senior Member Posts: 13,722 Senior Member

    What about a Sherpa wearing a Serpa?
    *mind blown*

    That would be the sherpa's Serpa.
    Overkill is underrated.
  • GunNutGunNut Posts: 7,642 Senior Member
    Jayhawker said:
    Well...at least the pistol functioned as intended...all the safeties disengaged and when he pulled the trigger it went off...can't blame the gun!
    There is that!  Actually the holster did too.  Total user error CF…
  • BigslugBigslug Senior Member Posts: 8,881 Senior Member
    One of my favorite negligent discharge videos:



    Pistol in question is a Beretta 92 or 96, and I just looked REALLY close - - the hammer starts down in the DA first shot position.

    The manual safety didn't prevent it.

    The DA first shot didn't prevent it - even though the officer is a small-ish female without rippling biceps. Adrenaline alone got her cranking straight through the 10# first shot.

    Now, what I CAN'T divine from the video is that after the ND - as she goes to holster the pistol - does she get the safety/decocker engaged, or is she holstering a cocked and unlocked firearm that has NEITHER the benefit of a 1911's grip safety, or a Glock's all-safeties-re-engage-and-it-decocks-when-you-let-go system.  That could have made an already bad day even worse.

    This individual would likely have had the same ND with any other handgun - proof that Zee is correct in that "Nothing is safe from Stupid".  A Glock, DAO auto, a revolver, or even a 1911 at least take some steps to minimize the chance of a repeat once stupidity is realized.  I think it's my much-loathed DA/SA autos that may be the scarier item in the hands of the ****
    WWJMBD?

    "Nothing is safe from stupid." - Zee
  • ZeeZee Senior Member Posts: 26,471 Senior Member
    edited June 14 #291
    Yep, nothing is safe from STUPID. It defies all logic and common sense to brandish its ever present ability to exist in defiance of Natural Selection. 
    "To Hell with efficiency, it's performance we want!" - Elmer Keith
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